Originally posted here, on June 3, 2014 at 7:48 PM, but reposted here since the blog site seems unavailable according to my browser. I had to use the Wayback Machine to get it.
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READING IN THE SHADOWS
A blog for the creepy side of all of us
Opinion on the Slenderman Murder Attempt
Normally I like to comment on news events when they relate to typical RitS subject matter, but I never thought Iâd write about something like thisâŚ
Apparently two 12 year old Wisconsin girls attempted to kill a mutual friend in order to please Slenderman, a well-known character created on the internet. Believing Slenderman to be real, they had the bright idea to commit the crime and run away to become proxies; basically his servants. Fortunatly, as of this writing the victim is still alive and recovering in the hospital.
As a creepypasta fan, I cannot describe how disturbing and stupid this crime is to me. Not only were they willing to harm someone they knew, planning it over several months, but for something intangible as internet fiction. Itâs very clear that Slenderman is a work of fiction-people often mention how he was created by Something Awful members. Nothing in his mythology suggests that he favors people who kill in his name or has a mansion somewhere that he takes people to. In stories Iâve read, Slenderman drives people insane, murders them and leaves their organs in little plastic bags, or simply makes them disappear. I really want to smack both these girls in the head and yell at them about this differences between reality and fiction, and ask them how they managed to come up with all this crap.
I do however, realize many people following this story may be getting a crash-course in creepypasta and Slenderman, so let me give you some basics:
1. Slenderman is a fictional monster made up in a Something Awful photoshop contest. People took the idea and ran with it, making up countless stories and even a few video series and games. His common traits include having no face, wearing a black suit, having tentacles, teleporting, messing with peopleâs minds, and using these abilities to kidnap children and terrorize adults. You can read more about him here.
2. Creepypasta is a term for short, scary stories spread around the internet. There are famous Creepypasta characters, much like there are many famous horror movie villains. Some examples include Jeff the Killer, the Rake, Smile Dog, Ben, and more. Creepypasta is no secret, Google it and itâs easy to find all kinds of information â particularly that they are all a work of fiction.
3. Creepypasta fans do not advocate murder or any other heinous, harmful actions. We just like reading and writing scary stories. No more, no less. Weâre just as upset about what these girls have done as everyone else.
Most of all I have to ask all of you out there to please donât start spouting that creepypasta, the internet, or videogames are harmful. They are not the root of this problem. I would argue the lack of good parenting and mental healthcare are. If you donât want your kids reading horror stories, keep an eye on what theyâre doing on the net. Spend some time with your kid and get to know them â this will make it easier to spot any psychiatric problems if any exist. You know, the kind of things a responsible parent is supposed to do anyway?
My hopes are with the victim and that she recovers quickly from this terrible event. The creepypasta community has started a fundraiser for her, and I highly recommend giving what you can to help her and her family through this ordeal.
(Note: Their fund-raiser is closed.)
This entry was posted on June 3, 2014 at 7:48 PM and is filed under Children, Creepypasta, In the News, Insanity, Murder with tags Creepypasta, Insanity, Murder, News, Slender Man, Slenderman, Stupid, Wisconsin.
Responses to âOpinion on the Slenderman Murder Attemptâ
đeyeontheuniverse Says:
June 4, 2014 at 5:36 AM
Ideas have power. People kill in the name of religion and political ideology all the time, and these arenât trivial one-off situations, but scenarios in which thousands or millions die in wars and other attacks.
There is a ton of research on desensitization and how the brain is altered from exposure. Of course not everyone who reads horror ends up killing, and most who play violent video games are just fine. but an increase in 1% in violence attributable to any of these causes means many real people who suffer.
Iâm not saying what should be done. You decide for yourself. But donât hide from reality because itâs easier for you to believe a lie. Everything you do, say, promote or pass on has an impact on others. It may not be the main contributing cause, butt he straw that breaks the camels back does as much harm as the 200 lb load it was already carrying.
đŠStephanie Selby Says:
June 4, 2014 at 9:19 AM
While I agree with you that ideas have power, reasonable people also have the ability to think critically and morally. These girls have a serious underlying problem that prevents them from doing that. Slenderman stories may have inspired their actions, but they would likely have found that inspiration somewhere else, perhaps religion or politics for example. Different straw, same result, so are all of them fit to blame in equal measure?
My opinion on psychopaths who kill is they would have done it anyway even if circumstances had been different. They only use political, social, or religious views to justify their actions; not only to others, but to themselves as well.
As for desensitization, I can sit through gory films without batting an eyelash, but I canât watch a real person getting sick from anesthesia after surgery or pick up a dead animal bare-handed. Thatâs because I understand that no one is really getting hurt in a film or videogame. I wouldnât be able to handle it otherwise. People with serious mental conditions should not be exposed to violent material, but thatâs because they have a medical condition that exacerbates the problems they already have.
Ideas do effect people, but that effect is different for everyone. Religion, politics, and much more have inspired people to achieve both great and terrible things. It depends on the individual and their ability to distinguish the difference between right and wrong.
đeyeontheuniverse Says:
June 4, 2014 at 11:59 AM
I agree that not everyone is affected equally, but that can be said for a lot of things including malaria, TB, leprosy and the effects of inhaling asbestos. The question is at what point the number of people who are changed, possibly dangerously so, matters. We donât wait o take action until 100% of the population is at immediate risk.
Iâm also very wary of peopleâs self-reports. The problem is you donât have a control group when you are looking at your own experience. There is no twin version of you (Iâm guessing) who has never watched a horror move for comparison. This is why we look at real research and use that as the basis for our decisions.
Iâm afraid I canât necessarily agree on the sociopaths. Many just lack empathy (and often only conditionally) but do not have an inherent desire to kill. When a person lacks empathy they may or may not kill, but they can be primed to do so much more easily than a person who does have empathy. Additionally, not all who kill for religion or other beliefs are sociopaths (by which i mean have ASPD.
đŠStephanie Selby Says:
June 4, 2014 at 1:35 PM
Comparing a fictional story to a dangerous disease is a pretty bad comparison. Disease is harmful to humans in all cases. In order to convince me that horror fiction is dangerous to everyone, I need to see some clear evidence. Not just two dumb kids that believed a fictional character was real, made up a bunch of other crap, and acted on fantasy.
And where do you draw the line exactly? Scenes in Orwellâs 1984 are pretty graphic, so are a ton of Stephen Kingâs works. Creepypasta fans are often armature writers trying to entertain others. So do we censor it? Ban it entirely?
I referenced my personal experiences because it simply serves as an example. Iâm not claiming that itâs a final answer or that another person will react differently.
For another example, I have a friend that avoids horror subjects because sadly, it triggers her PTSD. Some people are allergic to peanuts, but you donât see retailers removing it from their shelves. Rather, there are warning labels so people know whatâs in their food. When one picks up a novel or reads a story, thereâs the general understanding that the work is fiction and may contain graphic content. Itâs not the fault of the story or writer if a member of their audience is unable to distinguish reality from fantasy.
You say that youâre not making any suggestions on what to do on the matter, but it sounds like you believe that horror fiction will perpetrate violence and in order to prevent that such ideas must be repressed or even erased. So what exactly is your aim in all this?
If you really do have studies that say scary stories or videogames turn people into murders, please send me a link because I would like to see them.
đeyeontheuniverse Says:
June 4, 2014 at 2:17 PM
Stephanie, The point I was making relies on the fact that many, if not most, diseases do not, in fact, harm everyone equally. Only about 5% of the population is susceptible to leprosy, for example, but we donât say âto heck with it, letâs do nothing, itâs only 5%. The same goes for the other diseases i mentioned; there is a genetic susceptibility that only is present in some cases, so the comparison is accurate.
I am certainly not recommending banning these sites, but different rules apply to children all the time. You canât drive until you are 16, smoke until 18 or drink until 21. You might quibble about the exact ages and rules here, but I think we all can agree that you donât hand a 4 year old a six pack, a cigarette and the car keys.
There are a few reasons for this and all of them have to do with the fact that the brain hasnât finished developing until the mid 20s, and kids simply donât have the background and knowledge to process data as adults do. Not only does the undeveloped frontal lobe lead to erratic and unpredictable behaviors, but the general pruning and development still taking placed are much more strongly influenced by the environment when one is young â for good and bad.
We have to draw lines; thatâs what we do as a society. I donât know what the answer will be, but information is slowly leaking out to the public which has long been known by experts in child development. Thereâs the same resistance we saw regarding smoking that lasted decades, but eventually we are going to see restrictions on content access for kids, and parents who bypass these restrictions held accountable just as they are for giving their kids other dangerous substances.
These arenât ideas, they are entertainment. I donât expect to see any restrictions on what kids can read ABOUT the horror genre, but the impact of entertainment forms on children really isnât controversial in the world of psychology, itâs just mainstream culture, which is also still busy debating evolution and global warming, that is refusing to accept the science in favor of intuition, personal experience and âcommon senseâ.
đeyeontheuniverse Says:
June 4, 2014 at 2:24 PM
Stephanie, Youâre really going to want to do your own research here, but this is a good place to start:
Really this stuff isnât controversial and there data, as I said already, is out there and clear cut just as the research on smoking was for years, and the research on evolution and global warming still is being fought in the US. In each case we find different groups who want to wear the blinders for their own self interest, but the blinders are the same.
đeyeontheuniverse Says:
June 4, 2014 at 2:27 PM
Hereâs the 2011 APA statement.
I hate repeating myself, but people defending this stuff for kids really need to get it. This is controversial like evolution is controversial and to anyone whoâs read the research the arguments sound about the same.
đŠStephanie Selby Says:
June 4, 2014 at 3:06 PM
Okay, who said that this stuff is for kids? Itâs not. I admit that Iâm not a parent, but even I wouldnât let my kids read graphic content until they were older. As I said in my original post, parents should be keeping an eye on what their kids are reading on the internet. If you donât want your kids reading this stuff, tell them and set up parental controls if necessary.
Thereâs a lot of creepypasta that isnât gory or graphic, and I think that young people can handle reading tales of that nature. Take âBen Drownedâ for example â itâs about a copy of Zelda that is haunted by a dead child; the copy of Zelda in the story has many eerie changes to a normal copy, but nothing terribly violent or gory. Should kids read âCupcakes,â a story where Pinkie Pie brutally and graphically kills another MLP character? No!
Iâm not saying kids should read stuff that isnât appropriate for their age. My argument is that fiction is not a precursor to violent behavior.
đ§enigmaticmonster Says:
June 4, 2014 at 7:42 AM
We agree with you 100% on the topic. People who write horror fiction make things up all the time, and they know itâs made up . . . Itâs not their fault if someone takes their ideas too seriously.
đeyeontheuniverse Says:
June 4, 2014 at 9:04 AM
Itâs really going to depend how you define âfaultâ here. I recommend that as an exercise you try writing out a definition. As David Chalmers would suggest, when we canât agree on the meaning of a word, or even that it has one, letâs put the word aside and discuss the subject without it.
The questions I would ask are:
1. Are the authors of these works providing writing that is a contributing factor in the events?
2. Does the writing contribute benefits to readers and society that could not as well or better be gained through other activities?
As an aside, there is a lot of research on font and color design out there â white on a black background is very difficult to read and will put off a lot of a siteâs audience, even folks who may not know what it is they dislike about reading the text.
âŹď¸đşBlackwolf Says:
June 4, 2014 at 8:45 PM
1. Are the authors of these works providing writing that is a contributing factor in the events?
Short answer: no. Creepypasta writers pen scary stories in an attempt to entertain others. Their is no intent on their part to incite acts of violence or murder.
In this specific case, these two girls are very possibly mentally disturbed (weâll have to wait for the trial, I imagine, to get any more details about their state of mind). They used the Slender Man mythos and created their own delusions regarding it. The mansion they believed theyâd be taken to, as well as murder as an act of summoning Slender Man, are not general traits that this character is known to have. Their motives for this attempted murder are based on fabrications on their own part.
Itâs rather interesting that you mention religion and politics as motives for murder. Instead of mere horror stories that are written for pure entertainment, religion and politics have directly incited people to commit atrocities for millenia.
Ocean Elf: *Scowl* Actually it's not all that interesting, and I could see this coming from 10 miles away with the first mention of religion and politics, especially religion. Some loser always looks for an excuse to be a Bible-basher.
Neither are religion and politics even the main contributing factors for violence. Power-lust, greed, hate, and simply the capability to be truel and sadistic are what lies behind it. People have been using politics and misusing, abusing religion, perverting it to excuse their actions. And since you do the typical anti-Christian thing and spout some BS about how you think the Bible is more harmful than some crappy fiction, so you compare people who believe in it to these Slender girls, I take big umbrage with that...!
âŹď¸đşBlackwolf spewed: The Bible contains stories that are extremely graphic and reprehensible, đ§ââď¸Ocean Elf: Shakespear plays contain stories that are extremely graphic and reprehensible. So do many writings by ancient historians, philosophers etc.
âŹď¸đşBlackwolf: and is most certainly a contributing factor in violence đ§ââď¸Ocean Elf: Bullcrap! People who try excusing their deranged actions by quoting from the Bible are perverting it, as they would pervert anything for their own gratification.
In ancient times, people's whole idea of religion and politics was a lot different, the Bible is both a history book and a guide. The old Testament describes how people lived and what they believed. The New tells us through Jesus and his early followers how to live to avoid stuff like the Slender Man stabbings occurring, not promoting them - AT ALL!
âŹď¸đşBlackwolf: even up to today, đ§ââď¸Ocean Elf: So where's your condemnation of the Koran? It isn't Christians who are horribly violent today, it's Islamists. You fail to mention paganism, in the ancient world, pagan cults were violent. There are various obscure tribes in the world today where they engage in violent ignition rites into manhood and womanhood that have nothing to do with Christianity or the Bible.
âŹď¸đşBlackwolf: much more so than any creepypasta. đ§ââď¸Ocean Elf: Wrong!
Simply put, the Bible doesn't glorify killing. The most popular creepy pastas the fangirls go nuts over, do, or at least, the fandom acts as if it's all cool.
But your comparing these girls with people for believing in the Bible is just typical anti-Christian wishful thinking bullshit...
âŹď¸đşBlackwolf: Yet, I donât see you advocating its abolition or censure. đ§ââď¸Ocean Elf: Oh, boo-hoo for you, just cry me a freaking whinging river over that. Idiot!
âŹď¸đşBlackwolf: 2. Does the writing contribute benefits to readers and society that could not as well or better be gained through other activities? đ§ââď¸Ocean Elf: No... But you're going to say "yes" because you're so predictably awesome like that.
Creepy pastas aren't meant to be a guide for conduct, and they certainly aren't history books...
As for entertainment, you can watch a horror movie, read a book, play an intense game, without it being a creepy pasta. So has it actually brought anything new there? No. It's copy paste with a horror bent, so chain letters Aka memes. Memes, with fandoms...
âŹď¸đşBlackwolf: Creepypasta, as well as any other horror story, movie, etc. invokes fear in the reader for the purpose of entertainment. đ§ââď¸Ocean Elf: Doesn't work on me. Besides, unlike some, maybe even most horror movies, pastas often claim they are real, and then some go as far as to make crowdsource videos to make that claim seem convincing. That's why there have been so many "Is Slender Man real?" questions all over the internet. Everybody knows horror movie villains aren't real. So creepy pasta scaredy-cats are either convinced the pastas are real, or else they are trolls pretending they're real, to up the scare factor in others. That's mind-games, not cool.
âŹď¸đşBlackwolf: Quite frankly, I enjoy a safe place to feel scared from time to time. Iâm sure there are others who feel the same. I canât think of any other activity that fulfills that quite like these. đ§ââď¸Ocean Elf: So...Horror and suspense movies and literature aren't doing that for you? Sad.
âŹď¸đşBlackwolf Says:
June 4, 2014 at 9:26 PM
âStephanie, The point I was making relies on the fact that many, if not most, diseases do not, in fact, harm everyone equally. Only about 5% of the population is susceptible to leprosy, for example, but we donât say âto heck with it, letâs do nothing, itâs only 5%. The same goes for the other diseases i mentioned; there is a genetic susceptibility that only is present in some cases, so the comparison is accurate.â
Diseases and creepypasta = apples and oranges. I think the fact that you make the comparison at all belies your bias. đ§ââď¸Ocean Elf: Oh! Hear that? Don't like creepy pasta, you must be "BIASED!" That's about as logical as "You don't like friendship chain letters? You're nasty!"
Creepy pastas are, from what I've seen, more of an addiction than a disease, but where they compare with disease is their virality. Disease spreads. Memes spread. Memes, like disease, don't effect everybody the same way. Now that's been sorted out, the wolf can shut up and go any time.
âŹď¸đşBlackwolf: On the other hand, creepypasta has no more adverse effects than other forms of entertainment, đ§ââď¸Ocean Elf: No, it's just annoying, and that goes double for the fandom. (Not to be confused with casual fans).
âŹď¸đşBlackwolf: and provides a great benefit: đ§ââď¸Ocean Elf: No greater than any other form of entertainment. Often, not even as good.
âŹď¸đşBlackwolf: there is a whole community on the internet that writes, critiques, and reads horror stories for their enjoyment. đ§ââď¸Ocean Elf: As well as any other genre - and not all horror stories are creepy pastas.
âŹď¸đşBlackwolf: Rather than violence in entertainment being a devastating pathogen, itâs more comparable to sugar. đ§ââď¸Ocean Elf: Oh, really? Could you possibly get any droller? How about comparing it with something without sounding like a sugar-phobic food-cop? You already struck out with that anti-Bible babble, and this isn't helping.
I could compare this violence to something like risk-taking, or even thrill rides.Heck, even fire. In a fireplace, it's safe. Not so much when it's out of control.
âŹď¸đşBlackwolf: For instance, my father has diabetes and has to limit his intake of sugar. Much like a diabetic, someone who may be susceptible to the depiction of violence in media needs to limit their intake of these depictions. Taking myself as an example, Iâm not diabetic and can be more lax with my intake of sugar, but I have to take care because I likely have a genetic predisposition for it. In terms of violence, Iâm fairly resistant: I started reading Stephen King when I was 12. I have never considered violence as a viable option for any problem in my life, nor has any form of media provoked me into violence. đ§ââď¸Ocean Elf:That's stupid. You can't compare a diabetic to fangirls who wonk out and try to kill a school mate.
This isn't even about how much is too much. The way creepy pasta is presented and how lax sites can be about crazed fandom activity is the problem.
âŹď¸đşBlackwolf: Much like sugar, it is the job of the parents to regulate the childâs intake of media. đ§ââď¸Ocean Elf: It is up to the parents to regulate anything when it comes to their kids, not just media. But you can't properly regulate something when freaks are making up gory stories about characters from little kid TV shows like MLP. Because there's no way to be 100% sure your kid won't stumble on "Cupcakes" when doing a search for Pinkie Pie. And that's a big problem with the creepy pastas that take kiddy lit/shows and corrupt them into this perverted disgusting crap.
âŹď¸đşBlackwolf: We have not banned sugar, politics, religion, or media. We also (generally) donât censor any of these things. đ§ââď¸Ocean Elf: Wanna bet? Look at CNN lately?
âŹď¸đşBlackwolf: While you say that you donât have any suggestions on what to do about this subject, it sounds very much like you want to censor violence in media, and more specifically creepypasta. I understand that exposing suggestible or mentally unbalanced people to violence is a definite risk, but are you willing to sacrifice the freedom for thousands if not millions to write and enjoy scary stories for the fear that a handful will use them to feed their own delusions? đ§ââď¸Ocean Elf: Dry up. Creepy pasta isn't going anywhere.
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